Episode 82SN: Episode 82: A Doula (and Mother of 5) offers Miscarriage Support and Much More: Aliza’s story, Part II

Aliza  0:17  

So anyway, the doctor came in, but after six hours of being an eight centimeters, he was like, Okay, we really tried giving you as much time as we could, but that’s it in 10 minutes. There’s nothing new. We’re starting Pitocin and I looked at my Doula, and I’m like, no Pitocin going on. Here. Within 10 minutes my baby was out. Yeah. And I in that moment and she was like, giving me this like guided meditation to really watch my baby coming out and like really imagine it and talk to my baby and, and I really worked on in those moments, those things that were blocking me. And as I blocked as I took away all those things that were blocking me, my baby came out. And yeah, it was a big learning experience. And I remember my Doula telling me then, every baby comes in a completely different way, because they’re coming to teach you something completely different. And they’re gonna live their lives in a completely different way. And each child teaches you something so different. And even now as they grow up, I remember that so much like the fact that I did something with my older, with my older children. One way doesn’t mean that my younger children are going to need the same same kind of thing. Yeah, so that was my second child. 

 

P  1:33  

Wow, that’s also kind of an amazing story because you’re so present for all of it. And so self aware about what’s happening in your body, which I think is a an amazing ability to have and remarkably useful. The thing I can relate to is the resistance. Because I remember the first couple of contractions, took my breath away, but were not painful in part because I didn’t know what was going on. And it didn’t, wasn’t my immediate reaction to resist them. But once I started to resist, because I was worried about it, then became painful, then it’s like a fight.

 

A  2:08  

Right? I see many times with my clients even like, as a doula I see it many times that when they don’t know that it’s the contraction. It’s not painful. Yeah. But when, when all of a sudden oh my gosh, it really it hurts so much. I can’t do it anymore. I don’t think I’d like to really understand that. Even when my Doula told me that in between contractions, nothing’s happening. You’re not in pain. Like there’s nothing that’s causing it. To me that was completely like this epiphany like, Oh, it’s just working with each contraction. And really being present in each moment. And I will say, it’s something that I learned it’s not something that I that I was completely living before I had my babies, but I feel like birth is really something that allowed me to learn all these lessons for my life and it really changed how I could be present with my children. I use the same Hypno birthing techniques with you know, pain and other things actually have to go through like this dental work now that I’m going through and I use the same Hypno birthing techniques to like let go of pain. And it really works. You know, like when we’re able to not be in resistance to what’s going on. around us. We can ride the wave.

 

P  3:19  

I want to try that at my next dental appointment. That’s good advice. So the second one’s back and home and how are things with two little ones now? Now you have two under two, right?

 

A  3:31  

I have two under two and here’s where it starts getting complicated. Now I noticed they that I probably also had postpartum depression that I wasn’t willing to admit at the time. And now that I look back, there are many things that I see that I’m like, oh, okay, that’s probably what it was. It was really difficult also, because my my second child, he was a completely different baby than what I knew, I thought and I had all this haughtiness after my first one, that when you’re a calm parent, then you have come kids, but then I had my second one, and he was the farthest thing from calm, which is funny because today He’s very calm, but as a baby, he probably had some food like allergies and things that were bothering him in his stomach. And he was he was crying constantly, like even from the also he always wanted me like it was something unbelievable that from the minute he got out of my belly, he only wanted to be with me and he like knew to smell me the day after if anybody else would hold him he would cry. Unbelievable. Yeah, like something. I remember my mother in law saying like, I’ve never seen a baby at this age that anybody else takes him and he starts crying and only when I would hold him, he wouldn’t sleep. And he would cry. And I just felt like I was I was home with two two kids under the age of two. My husband wasn’t home most of the time. And it was really difficult, really difficult. I felt like I was crashing. I didn’t know at that time to also say that it was probably a lot of postpartum depression. And I fell into a really big, deep pit, like really bad. Also, at that time, we decided that we were going to go and move for a few years to Uruguay. We went to go work in the community there and it was in the midst of all that when I wasn’t completely aware yet of what was going on with me. He was six months old when we got there. And here I am in a new country, new language so much going on. And I really had to learn how to slowly take myself out of that pit and that was a big, big learning that I had

 

P  5:45  

so much. Yeah, that’s so much transition in a short amount of time. Right. So now in about two years, you have two kids new, you know, moved house which is a big deal to a different country and it sounds like you’re not a native Spanish speaker. And that’s a lot right. And now you’re not with your family or not with your friends. That’s a big move.

 

A  6:09  

Yeah, it was a lot and we were also in a very demanding position that my husband wasn’t home a lot and he was going through his transition of being in this new role and I was doing it was a lot. Also we felt like we have the strongest connection ever. Nothing can break us down. And all of this really like completely like shattered us up so that we could rebuild ourselves in a completely new way. So in those moments, again, it was really difficult and we thought we were gonna come back and we felt that we were just gonna give everything up. And then we were able to really like after completely breaking down to be able to build ourselves back together piece by piece by piece.

 

P  6:50  

So that’s amazing. So a third child is born in Uruguay, right? Yes.

 

A  6:55  

So a third child is born in Uruguay. And in Uruguay, like many South American countries, that the C section rate is very, very high. There’s like a lot of childbirth myths going on there. Like so much misinformation. And the hospital where I was supposed to give birth because that was my insurance. The C section rate was 90% Oh my god scared me. Like, really scared me. I felt like couldn’t even think of what was going to happen. So I started researching and searching for some doctor who was going to be able to be with me and encouraged a natural birth because it was really important to me. And I found the only doctor who was willing to go with me and but the like they know in the hospital that when he comes everybody takes a step back because they know that he does it completely differently. And it was the most beautiful experience ever. So I had a friend who really really wanted to talk to me for a long time and I kept saying, I’m not having the baby until I talked to you. And like I said it as a joke. But then I was ready to have the baby and I was like you know what, maybe because I haven’t talked to her yet. I’m not happy with the baby. So I invited her to my house and we were talking until again. Again another birth that started with late night talks. We were talking until like 130 in the morning. Then she went home and again at four in the morning contractions started and I called my doula. my Doula came we were I was in the bath a little bit and she saw that it looked like I was really moving forward. And she said she thinks I should probably start going to the to the hospital. So we call the doctor and he was on his way as well. And we were just like really in this bubble that we were able to create. Again, I want to say it’s also because we were after this, this period of time of transition and transformation that we like rebuilt ourselves. And we were in and I really feel like we were rebuilt before that and we came to this bird link in a beautiful united and connected way. So we were just like swaying and swinging again and singing and and really just enjoying and we get to the hospital. Now. Uruguay is an atheist country and you can see me your podcast listeners won’t see me but I am an orthodox do. I wear a head covering like I’m kind of odd there they you know I’m like the I mean all my neighbors knew me and they knew that I was the odd one but you know for the when I walked into the hospital they were like, what is this going on? And anyways it was very weird because there they have never seen the the nurses that I was with. They said they have never seen a woman who chose not to get an epidural or not to get a C section like a woman that chose to come and have a natural birth they’ve never saw that before. So And here I was coming with my with my music in my hand. And and but we were just singing and we were singing in Hebrew, also in Uruguay, singing Hebrew songs and bouncing on the ball and just like completely blissful. And when we walked in, I said to my Doula, I was like, How many centimeters Do you think I’m at? Later, she told me she thought I was at four and I said, I’m telling you I’m six centimeters. And the doctor came and he checked me. He was like, okay, the six centimeters was like, Okay, great. Let’s go. So we walk into the into the room, and he asked me if I wanted to be checked anymore. And he said, you know, let’s just go with it. And the whole time I was so connected with what was going on in my body. And he was so enabling to really be in that belief. You know what to do with your body? Like I would ask him Okay, now what? And he’d be like, You know what to do? You tell me like it’s your you know how to birth, which was amazing. It was really, really amazing. I mean, he was there watching me the whole time. It’s not like he was but it was very empowering. And so we were just like, really enjoying there and, and he would ask me like, Okay, how are you feeling? And I, I’d say to him, now I feel like my baby needs a little more time to come down. He’s still not all the way down. And then finally I said to him, Okay, I think I think the baby’s down and he checked me. And he said, Yeah, you’re fully dilated. Do you want to do you want to start putting anything? No, I’m not having a contraction yet. I laid down and I my contraction stopped for a few minutes, which is a beautiful secret that many birthing mothers don’t know that our body naturally gives us this resting time before we push many times. We don’t see it when we’re in a medical environment. But our body gives us that sometimes it’s three minutes. Sometimes it’s not a long time, but it gives us this time to really regroup and give ourselves that energy before we go to the last phase of pushing.

 

P  11:39  

So when you say many people don’t feel is that because if you had an epidural, you wouldn’t feel it. Right? You

 

A  11:45  

don’t know when you’re having your contract when you’re having contractions or not. And also many women at this at this stage, they’re already if they’re in hysterics, they’re in hysterics in between contractions as well and some some women you know, feel like they’re losing control, which is also another way to birth, which is a beautiful way to birth as well but complete lot to lose your control. And then you won’t feel it either. So but if you’re connected and you’re, then you’ll be able to end it doesn’t always happen but many times usually I see with my clients as well. That there is this kind of resting time. So I said to my to my doctor, I he’s not ready to come out just yet. And I lay down and we sing like another two songs. And then I got up and I was like Okay, I’m ready. And I actually have a video that my my husband said to me, how are you doing? And I was like I’m so great. He was like have what stage or yet was like I’m fully dilated. He’s like, Yeah, you like you like having a baby. It was like, Oh, I highly recommend it. It’s so beautiful. Like I was again completely drugged endorphins. And then I squatted and within two pushes he was out. Wow. And when when he came out, he was like complete. He had these huge eyes. And he was like looking at me and I said to the doctor, he’s not crying. So the doctor said to me if you had a birth like that, would you cry? And it was really just beautiful even a week after that. A friend of mine had a baby also in the same hospital and they found out that she was Jewish. So they’re like, Wait, do you know that Jewish woman that had the baby last week, and she was seeing the whole birth? We’ve never seen anything like

 

P  13:24  

that. So funny. A lot of Jews in Uruguay is what I’m hearing.

 

A  13:29  

No, there’s actually not so many. So when they find them, it’s kind of a novelty.

 

P  13:33  

It’s so funny to me, like do you know the other one?

 

A  13:36  

Well, I have, you know, clearly do it. They seem that

 

P  13:40  

that is super funny. So that’s another fabulous birth and what’s the what’s the age difference? What’s the gap between number two and number three? Two and a half years? Okay. Okay, so now you have three under four. Yeah.

 

A  13:56  

All right. My oldest was four.

 

P  13:57  

Yeah. So that seems like a lot or we’re all good.

 

A  14:02  

You know, going from two to three was so great. I mean, I think after after having my second baby who taught me like you don’t have control and you don’t really know what’s going on, and you know, have some more humility in your parenting. I think I was ready for whatever. And again, I was blessed with a really calm baby. And he was so easy and just really helped us in the transition, I guess. And it was just a really fun transition. We really enjoyed having another baby and watching the sibling dynamic is so emotional. I like even like until today all the time. I like see the dynamics between them. And I feel like there’s no bigger gift that I could give them then than this. You know each other. Yeah, that’s yeah, so yeah, so that was really special as well.

 

P  14:54  

Now, the first two babies you had an Israel Yeah. So there are there dramatic differences between other than the high C section rate between Israel and Uruguay that you were like, Oh, this is so different. Well, the

 

A  15:07  

hospital stay was actually very nice nearby because every gets their own room which in Israel is like not heard of. That’s one hospital that you would like pay extra. But there’s no such thing. I guess it’s also because of the high birth rates here in Israel compared to your right. There are many more birthing moms here. And also it was just like, kind of like a hotel but I don’t know there was like something very, very nice about the hospital there and the stay there. And also the duck because it was a private doctor and the whole system works very differently. But because it’s a private doctor, so you get to choose like, he said to me, tell me when you want to leave if you want to leave today if you want on tomorrow. Tell me when you went outside you like it was just very, that was very nice. It was very different than I wasn’t with my family. We were far away from family and that’s very different. We were very, very fortunate and lucky that a lot of our family did come a week after the birth but yeah, but going through all of that without family is also different. Yeah, yeah,

 

P  16:07  

that’s a little hard. Okay, so then or do we leave you’re away for the fourth.

 

A  16:12  

So I got pregnant, you’re going with the fourth. And that was also like when my when my third was about a year and a little bit and then when we came back to Israel, we were a few months after we came back I had my fourth and that was a homebirth a waterbirth a homebirth which was also really really beautiful. It was a Why do you

 

P  16:36  

that you’ve had so much success with the doula midwife Doctor model? Why are we changing it to home births, so the fourth one,

 

A  16:44  

okay, so I did have success and I didn’t have bad experiences. But for example, the second birth I felt that if I were at home for longer, I wouldn’t have gone so long. And I would have felt more comfortable and more oxytocin. You know, able, in my own home in my own environment without feeling threatened without feeling like I needed to always be like on the watch of what somebody was going to do to my natural birth, you know, which I want to say before I say anything about home birth. I believe that a woman births from herself, so it doesn’t matter where you’re at. You could be at a hospital, you could be at your home, wherever you are. You can have a beautiful birthing experience and I think that every woman has to make her own decision. Not because of some kind of societal, whatever. Every woman should do her own research and every woman should make her own decision. I don’t judge anyone for their own decision, and we shouldn’t judge anyone for their own decision. And it should just be something that you know, each woman is empowered to make that choice. So the fact that I had a home birth is not dissing the beautiful hospital births that I had. Well, I did I decide I did I did feel like I was at a place where I needed that privacy where I felt like that was I felt confident enough in myself that I was able to have a beautiful home birth and also I did more research. And I I wasn’t afraid like I was I grew up very afraid of home births. I always thought that it was women putting their own personal experience over the health of their babies. And I learned that it’s not about that at all. It’s about paying attention to the health of the mother and the baby. And it’s not about the experience. So I just like learned a lot about it. And it felt very right. My husband was Argentinian. All of his family were were born via C section he like for him this whole thing was very new. And for him it was a very scary thought. So I said to him, Look, let’s go to a midwife. We’ll talk to her. Ask her all the questions you have and then we’ll make a decision. Like I wasn’t. I wasn’t like completely. That’s it. Let’s do it. So we went and we went to speak to this midwife, and I chose a midwife who I knew she had a lot of experience. I think she was 20 years in the hospital and 12 years out of the hospital. Okay, so we went to go visit her just to like, go talk and ask her some questions. And my husband asked her all these questions, and he was very nervous about the whole thing. And after we left, I said to him, so what do you want to do? He was like, Yeah, let’s do it. Like, this is what we’re gonna do. So yeah, there’s a lot of prep that there isn’t when you have a hospital birth also, I I love hosting people. And I love people feeling comfortable in my house and I felt like if I’m having my doula and my midwife and I don’t know who’s gonna come after, I want there to always be like, really good, cooked nourishing food in the house. So like I felt like this. This pressure to always have like food in the freezer, and lots of like different options. So I always was like, packing the house with the food. And the kids were very much a part of the process because the midwife was coming to her house, and they would help her find the heartbeat which was super emotional and super exciting. And that was a really fun part. I didn’t want them to be a part of the birthing experience because I was afraid that I wasn’t going to be able to be in my bubble if I was being worried also about them like if I was thinking about you know, their needs, if it’s okay for them to be be at every point like if I was thinking about them. And caring for their needs, I wasn’t going to be able to completely go into my birthing bubble. So I didn’t want them to be at the birth they were also pretty little at that time. I did my

 

P  20:26  

totally fair and like if they don’t understand it, it could be scary. And I yeah, that all that makes sense. Right? So I decided

 

A  20:33  

that I didn’t want them to be with us and my parents who lived pretty close to where we were living at that time. They were going to come and take them. So it was actually a weekend, the second weekend that they went to my parents, and we were but we were like on a honeymoon vacation. We felt like it was really nice to be just the two of us without any kids. Since I don’t know when and we were just we lived in a place that was like in the middle of of the forest and it was like kind of raining the whole day and we went out walking the whole day and I started feeling a little bit of contractions in the morning and then played started coming on and then towards the afternoon. A little bit more. And then towards the evening. I felt like okay, this is really real now. We started tracking my contractions, which is the first time in my life I can track contraction because I needed to tell the midwife when she should come out to us. So we started tracking, tracking the contractions and I sent like the screenshot to my to my midwife, and she said look, it doesn’t look like it’s real labor yet because you have like every seven minutes and then every format, and then every five and then three and like it’s not so consistent. But here’s a really good thing that every woman should know every woman is different and like we said it doesn’t all go according to the books. And I knew that my body never was consistent, I guess kind of consistent with my personality. I’m not such a consistent person. I like to think to go with the flow. And I knew that with all my groups it’s it never goes consistent. So I said to my midwife, you know with all my books, it’s it’s like that and I feel like I’m in real birth. So she’s like, okay, you know your body the best. So she came out to us. And when she came she checked me and I was seven centimeters. Wow. Yeah. And again, music. It was actually the festival of Hanukkah of Hanukkah. Wow. So we had the lights burning and like it was like this beautiful, kind of divine kind of environment, feeling and ambiance and it was just

 

P  22:30  

this sounds cinematic for sure. It was it really was

 

A  22:33  

like we dim the light. We also had like the life that you could like dim in all different levels. And so my husband like played around with the lights to make it beautiful. We had music playing and it was it was really beautiful. We we blew up the pool in the middle of the house. And my husband was in charge of the hot water the whole time. And he and he was in charge of that as I as the contractions kept coming out. I said I’m ready to go into the pool. I got into the pool kept on breathing a little more. And it was just really fast and kind of I think it was like in total three and a half hours. I like touched she my midwife said to me, you you test like you tell me when you’re ready and you can you can feel which was so cool for me because I never really felt like it was my third birth. My doctor said here put your hand and try and feel his head and I couldn’t because of the way I was squatting or I don’t know what I couldn’t feel him. But this time I like really felt him coming out. So I like was able to feel his hair in the water. Wow. And as I was in that moment, my husband was filming me it was important for me to send a video to the kids like during the birth or whatever. So he was filming me in and I’m like telling them the baby’s coming you coming? Really really soon you’re gonna meet your brother soon. And then and he sent that to the kids and like he wrote to my mother we we feel the head or whatever. And then within like 10 minutes the baby was out, which was amazing. It was it was really beautiful, like so blissful.

 

P  24:09  

Like that birth was physically easier in the water and at your house.

 

A  24:14  

I think so. Yeah. I definitely think there was something very I don’t know the word enabling is coming up again like just enabling and given making space for be vulnerable in whatever way you want. And there was something very, very calming in that that allowed me to birth in a very calming and beautiful way. Like I wasn’t afraid of anything around me. I don’t know, I don’t know how to explain it. So that was really really amazing. And the water was great. It was really great. Also it was freezing cold at that time also so being in warm water it was amazing. And then having a baby and crawling into your own bed is like unbelievable. That sounds like comfortable and

 

P  24:57  

especially when

 

A  25:01  

your other choice is to be

 

P  25:02  

share a room with someone else. Right? Right.

 

A  25:05  

Right. So it was unbelievable and my midwife also she did all my laundry at when I was like nursing the baby she’s like started cleaning the whole house and she did all my laundry and she like left the house with with like all different she left me all these different herbal tinctures and all these different like aromas in the house that I should have. And it was just like, I felt like I was in a spa like in my own home. So it was beautiful. That sounds awesome.

 

P  25:29  

That sounds totally amazing. And now why the fifth one is not in your house. Right? Right. So the fifth one was not in my house. We had

 

A  25:37  

moved and for technical reasons only. I couldn’t have my fifth one in at home. But this is the proof that it doesn’t matter where you are if you are in your body you can be empowered in your connection with your body and with what’s going on. Because the fifth birth I decided that I was going to choose a hospital according to which hospital would allow me to have a waterbirth so I chose which hospital I was going to go to we needed to drive a little further to we came it was actually in the middle of a crazy rainstorm here that it was like kind of a hurricane but not exactly a hurricane. And it was pouring rain. And the contraction started at night I called my mother the teacher come and be with the kids. She came and she was with the kids and contractions were already coming like every two minutes, but I felt that they weren’t so strong yet and that they were I was like still in the beginning and I said to her Don’t worry, we’re still in the beginning. She was like no, you’re gonna have the baby in the parking lot. And I was like, no, no, I’m telling you. I still have to I’m still in the beginning. So we go into the car and it’s pouring rain like crazy, crazy rain. And then we park the car and there was like a little bit of a walk until the entrance to the hospital and until today my husband laughs at me about this. Because we started walking to the hospital and a contraction starts and I’m like, Okay, come here. Let’s start swaying. Like pouring rain. There’s thunder lightning and here we are dancing in the rain and holding a wall, holding the pool to blow up when we walk in. So here we are in the rain holding was local. And we walk in and I was like, Okay, I think I’m like in labor. And they check me and they’re like put your four centimeters, which I thought was important for me to come earlier because I wanted us to have enough time to blow up the pool and fill up the pool and everything for that and they were they said that we needed to have a perfect monitor if we wanted to be able to be in the pool. So I said okay, let’s do a monitor. Meanwhile, my Doula came and she was unbelievable. didn’t keep her hands off of me at all for one second. She was like massaging me the whole time and she was amazing. And I would pull on the ball, just singing waiting waiting for them to open up a room for us to go in. And we were again singing having a really great time. I was like dedicating songs to our family and sending messages look here we are having the baby and I’m singing this song for you. And then after like an hour and something they said to us, okay, the room is ready, you can go into the room, but there’s a little bit of a dip in the monitor. So you’re not going to be able to go into the pool yet. You have to have another perfect monitor. When you get into the room. We walk into the birthing room and I feel like things are getting much more serious. And I looked at my doula and I was like okay, like things are coming here. And I walked kind of barely to the to the room. And when I came in, they’re like, Okay, let’s check you again. And they checked me. And they said five centimeters. And I looked at my doula and I was like, huh I had these, like two voices inside of me. I had one voice, okay, it might take longer than I expected and I’m gonna let go of the control and that’s okay. And it’s okay if things are going to look completely different and I’m okay with that. And I had this other voice telling me my body is not at five centimeters. I am totally so much farther ahead than the doctor left after he checked me and I stood up to like try and get the pool started. I said to my husband, don’t blow up the pool. We’re not gonna have time for it. Because I stood up and I felt like I was already pushing and I said to my doula and my husband, I said, I’m going to break my waters right now and the next contraction and she’s going to come right out. And they’re like, Okay, like the midwife that heard me she was like, Okay, I don’t want your expectations to be so high. And I hear the monitor now. I’m a doula already. So I already have eyes on other things in the birthing rooms. And I hear that the monitor is beeping that the monitors that her heart rate was going down. And the next contraction I pushed because I was feeling a need to push already and I see that my water broke and I looked down and I saw that the water was a little yellow. And that’s why her heart rate was going down. And the doctor started coming in not just one doctor a few doctors because they see that the heart rate is going so much is going with with the so the yellow is meconium