Author: paulette_kamenecka

P: Hi, thanks so much for coming on the show. Could you tell us your name and where you’re from?

 

Lauren: Sure. Thank you for having me. My name is Lauren Burke, and I am from Chicago, Illinois.

 

P: That’s fun. So I lived there for many years. Where do you live?

 

L: I’m a life long northsider

 

P: Oh nice….So let’s talk about pregnancy before you got pregnant, I’m wondering, what did you imagine pregnancy would be like?

 

L: So here’s something kind of weird. I was not going to have kids, I decided. So I was sort of like, you know what, I don’t know if this is going to be the right track for me. And that’s partially because I had had so many friends who just had terrible experiences. And then also I live in the city and a writer, money just like that. That whole situation. So I was like, You know what, I don’t think that that is going to be the right scene for me. I was terrified. of childbirth, as well. completely terrified of it. I think this was like my late 20s.

 

 I had done this thing where I was like, You know what, I need to get in better shape and have this like cystic acne that keeps recurring and I keep trying everything and let me like, just really work out really hard. And let me go to the dermatologist and get all of these things under control before I’m 30 this was like my goal. It’s like I have all these goals before 30. So I went to the dermatologist and she was like, Okay, I’m actually let’s put you on Yaz. And that will clean up your sleep that. 

 

P: What’s that?

 

L: So yes, is a birth control. 

 

P: Okay

 

L:  Because she was like, you know, the reason why nothing has been working for you, is because it’s hormonal. So let’s get you on birth control. And then exactly six weeks later that my follow up appointment. That day, I was feeling really weird. I was like, out of breath. I was really dizzy. My friend actually offered me a ride like out of nowhere. Just offered me a ride to the doctor’s office cuz she was like you You seem kind of weird last night. So do you need a ride? I was like yes. Please. So we go to the doctor’s office, and she’s like, well, your skin looks great, but something’s going on with you. And she sent me to the ER, and I was having a pulmonary embolism. 

P: Oh my god. 

 

L: Blood clots everywhere. is basically how the nurse came back and she was like, yeah, they’re in your legs. They’re in your lungs. They’re all over. 

 

P: Oh my god. 

 

L: Yeah. So I was hospitalized.

 

P: I brought question about the link between birth control and blood clots to neurologist today. I’m excited to have Dr. Nichols sir on the show. She’s an Assistant Professor of Clinical neurology from the Miller School of Medicine at the University of Miami. Dr. Sir, thanks so much for coming on the show.

 

Dr. Sur: It’s my pleasure. Thanks so much for having me. Why birth control create the risk for blood clots. 

 

Dr. Sur: So the risk there is really due to the to the hormones, mostly estrogen so birth control are basically hormonal pills and there are estrogen in the birth control. There’s estrogen and progesterone, which is another hormone birth control. And the risk mostly comes from the actual estrogen because estrogen increases the concentration of clotting factors in the blood when there’s increased concentration of clotting factors, the blood can be more prone to clotting. 

 

P: So estrogen is sending signals to your bone marrow to make more clotting factors.

 

Dr. Sur: That’s correct. That’s kind of the pathophysiology.

 

P: One thing I wanted to add here is that according to webmd, blood clots are rare even with birth control. The rate is something like a point three to 1% over 10 years, you’re at a higher risk for blood clots with pregnancy than you are with birth control. And that’s again because of hormonal shifts.

 

L: You know, I also had a pleurisy let’s call it so I had this irritation in my lungs and it was very painful. And there was like 12 hours of just pain. And it was really bad.

 

P: And that sounds like a 17th century problem. 

 

L: Yes. Like it does. it’s so weird. And I was at Northwestern. So I had all these residents that kept coming in because they were like, Oh, this is this is interesting. We don’t see this every day. And after 12 hours of that, like turned on my husband. I was like, You know what, I think I can give birth because like, that was awful. I survived it. And I just like had this weird change of heart in the hospital. I was like, You know what, I think I want to be a mother. I want to take a kid to Disneyland. I don’t know what it is and she was like, Okay, let’s give this a couple of years and figure this all out. 

 

P: Yeah, 

 

L: at that point, that’s when I started sort of maybe eating up a little bit more on pregnancy and then I saw a ton of doctors because obviously I just had this PE and we needed to see if I had some sort of blood clotting condition or if it was just provoked by Yaz. And then what we needed to do so then. Yeah, so then I went on sort of like a fertility journey, which was a fun time.

 

P: Yeah, I mean, this will be this will be interesting if you actually did have to go through the fertility gauntlet went because I too, went through the fertility gauntlet at Northwestern. 

 

L: Oh, did you? Yes. Oh, we’ve probably crossed paths. Yeah. Because that was a couple of years of going to various doctors, lots of blood tests. I did find in OB that really specialized in this and he was very much of the mind that it was provoked and that I could have a normal pregnancy we would probably put me on a low dose blood thinner. And he said like no epidural. So that was kind of my plan. 

 

P: Wow. 

 

L: And then I had sort of a journey getting pregnant because it was not happening. It was just not happening right away. 

 

P: Yep.yep.

 

L:  And then I had some miscarriages as well, which then kind of triggered the doctors because they’re like, Well, maybe she does have a blood clotting issue. Maybe this is related. They really wanted to kind of tie it back to that PE so there was a couple of years of just trying to figure out why I couldn’t carry on a pregnancy what was going on,

 

P: let’s go a little slower here for one second. So first positive pregnancy tests you are pretty excited right my friend in a miscarriage also I guess people say oh, you’re not supposed to say okay, at least you can get pregnant, but I’ve been trying for a year and a half. So for me, right for me to get was actually a big deal to get pregnant at all. Up until then there was no evidence that I could, yeah, did you have that feeling as well? Or were you was it still just

 

L: totally very excited? Yeah. Really? Just like, Yes, this is this is it at that point, too. We had just purchased our house, and I just really felt like the timing was right. I felt like I was at a good place with work. Like it just felt like the stars were aligning. 

 

P: Yeah, yeah

 

L:  super happy about it. And I think and I lost that baby. I think I was I mean it was like 13 weeks. 

 

P: Uugh..that’s late

 

L: So it was late. It was late. And it sucked because I did definitely I told my mother of course first. Like a weekend was very much like don’t tell anyone.

 

P: So that’s a weird cultural thing. Right? I talked to a therapist who wrote her dissertation on the idea that we all I mean, I feel like my doctors told me Don’t tell anyone. So after the first trimester is over, Oh, for sure. But the therapist was like That’s nuts because you’re going to need support

 

L: and like in 11 weeks, I was like, this is fine. 

 

P: Yeah, yeah, totally 

 

L: So my family was like super excited. I had not told work yet. That was the only thing I was really nervous about because I was nervous about what are the one of the repercussions of this honestly, yeah. What projects will I have taken away from me? 

 

P: Yeah, 

 

L: was really the thought but that kind of sucked because then I had my miscarriage. And I had it on my birthday too, which was insane.

 

P: The gods have their backs turned. That’s not fair. That’s not cool

 

L: It was crazy. Not cool. Then I just kind of like politely ducked out of work. And I think everyone thought I just was going to celebrate an early birthday and no one had any idea it was going on. And then I just didn’t want to tell them and it just was kind of a whole awful awkward situation. 

 

P: Yeah. 

 

L: I was like, I need a few days off. It’s personal. I don’t want to talk about it

 

P: Yeah. Did you have support when that happened?

 

L: Yeah. And I think I’m the kind of person to like, I want I want to take care of everything. So I think with that miscarriage I kind of almost just powered through my friends were great. My family, they were great. My husband was great, but I kind of was just like, well, we’re just gonna carry on. We’re gonna soldier through 

 

P: Yeah, yeah. 

 

L; And I was almost feeling part of me was feeling almost a little positive because I was like, Well, I know I can get pregnant. Okay, so that’s a good thing. So we know that but what’s going on? You know, I can’t carry on this pregnancy. So yeah, but then I got pregnant again, probably two or three months after that. 

 

P: That’s awesome. 

 

L: That was great. Yeah. And that that was Audrey. So that is yeah, my daughter, so 

 

P: oh Wow, good, 

 

L: okay, that worked.

 

P: And so are you again, are you nervous for the first trimester or do you handle it differently?

 

L: Totally. Totally. Like, won’t tell a soul completely terrified. Yeah. Yes, absolutely. I remember my husband’s a marathon runner. 

 

P: Oh, wow. 

 

L: And so I found out the day of the Chicago Marathon. 

 

P: Oh, wow.

 

L: I woke up and was nauseous and felt like I had the flu. And it was like the first marathon I’d missed. Like, in 10…11 years. I was like, I can’t believe I can’t make it to your marathon today. And ended up being like his best time ever. And then he came back and I was like, I have not taken a pregnancy test. But I know that I’m pregnant. This is not the flu. And he was like, Okay, so let’s, yeah, we’re just gonna keep this one under wraps. But I went to the doctor immediately because of the the blood clotting issue. We knew that we had to we had to do a scan and we had to make sure that the you know, everything looked good. Because they were going to start me on a blood thinner pretty quickly. That was and that was, I think, yeah, maybe just a couple weeks after that. And then I was doing heparin shots twice daily.

 

P: Wow. So that sounds like they determine you did have a blood clotting issue.

 

L: This has been back and forth. This is the great mystery of me. Someday, someone will figure it out. But they were ruling that they didn’t think there was a blood clotting issue, but in case there was 

 

P: okay, 

 

L: we’re just gonna do it to be safe.

 

P: And for some reason because of this blood clotting issue and she you can’t have an epidural because your blood will pool while you’re laying there.

 

L: Yeah, so gosh, how did he describe it? So I will say this doctor who was like, Don’t do the epidural didn’t give me a ton of details. He was very much like, I remember him being very flippant. about it. He was like, Don’t do it. They don’t really work anyway. Just great for the hospital surveys. It was something along those lines. It was very flippant. He’s like don’t do it. It’s gonna mess everything up just as long as you don’t do the epidural, you’re fine. And then he had referred me to an OB who was a woman is great who’s still my OB. And I said, What do you think about this? And she’s like, actually, no, I’ve had women that have come in with the same thing. And her thought really was that you know, yaz, was the provoked the blood clots, and she’s like, honestly, we’re just doing this to be safe. I think you can still have the epidural. We’re going to you’re going to be on Heparin at that point in your pregnant pregnancy. And at that point, we will just time it out. We’ll try to time it out. So like you’re in between shots. Okay to give you the epidural 

 

P: So, Quick question, Dr. Sur. Why are we concerned about the epidural if Lauren’s on Heparin?

 

Dr. Sur: It sounds like the issue there may have been because of the treatment, the way you treat blood clots circulating in the blood, especially if they’re enough to cause PE or pulmonary embolism. So a blood clot in the lung. So that’s treated with blood thinners. Or anticoagulation. So now the risk instead of clotting, the risk is then bleeding. And so it’s kind of weighing the risk of clotting versus bleeding. So so with an epidural, it’s essentially a spinal puncture so the risk is bleeding on anticoagulation

 

P: and then once you cross the first trimester, feeling better, how do we feel?

 

L: Feeling great, was traveling. I had some stuff going on for work. Still not telling anyone didn’t tell like partly what I told my best friend who was dabbling with but didn’t really tell a ton of people that I was pregnant until I started showing, honestly, 

 

P: okay, that makes sense

 

L: Yeah. And then I was like, surprised.

 

P: And then how was the rest of the pregnancy? 

 

L: Great, besides giving myself shots constantly, which was a pain in the butt, especially when I was traveling. Yeah. My pregnancy was fantastic. until like, the very end when I was just I was just sore all the time, obviously, like just normal stuff, but nothing. Nothing out of the ordinary. It was like very smooth sailing. I think that was one of the things that like, threw everyone off. Later on, because everything was so great blood pressure, great weight, great, like everything.

 

P: So how far did you make it? Did you make it to 40 weeks?

L: Yeah, so my daughter’s due date was June 11. And she was born on June 8. 

 

P: Wow. So take us to the day like how do you know today’s the day what what happens to your house?

 

L: That Day was insane. There was recently an article about this, but I was actually that day on the phone between Northwestern and Blue Cross who was my insurer, because they were sort of arguing over the payment for a scan that I had when I was pregnant with the child that didn’t make it miscarriage. So they were like, Oh, we’re billing you full price because it ended in a miscarriage. And I was like, was pregnant when I had the scan.

 

P: That that’s nuts that insurance companies live in their own bizarre world. That could be a podcast itself, right. 

 

L: it could be it absolutely could be. So I was going back and forth. And there was things that were coded incorrectly and and I was like, Can we code it correctly? Yeah. So it was back and forth with them for a really long time. And at one point, I had to leave the video conference and go to the bathroom and I just felt really weird. And I came back to the video conference, and I just was like, have you guys worked it out yet? And they were like, we’re still talking about the codes and bla bla and I sat down and my water just burst. 

 

P: Oh, wow. 

 

L: Like comedically, like like it was in a movie. And I said, Well, I have to go because my water has broken and I’m going to have a baby. So I really hope we can work this out at some point. And that was about four o’clock on a I think that was a Friday. And I was like, oh my god, I can’t believe this baby is coming like at rush hour or Yeah. And it’s so Adri now that I know her. I’m like, Yeah, you would do that.

 

P: That’s very funny. I hope we live close to Northwestern at this point

 

L: seven miles. 

 

P: oh….that’s not close in Chicago

 

L: In Chicago traffic that is not close. And I was waiting I waited for my husband to come home. So he got on the metro and he was home pretty quickly gets home by five and we right at five like we get on the highway to go to Northwestern and we are just sitting in traffic for a while. Yeah, we got to the hospital around like 615 ish. Yeah, I want to say and everything was calm, like everything was just chill. It was very fun. It was fine. 

 

P: were you having contractions? 

L: they were far apart. Okay. But I had called my OB and I was on the phone with her nurse and she was like, why don’t you to come in right away? Because we need to get blood tests going and stuff like that. Yeah. And I was like, all right. I feel great. I feel fine. I’m just like in the car. Listening to music. I’m like, strolling into the hospital. Everything’s fine. I think until like seven 730 And that’s when the action just like hit me like a train. 

 

P: uh Oh, 

 

L: that’s when they were like, oh yeah, this birth is happening. Like very quickly. So I remember I was in sort of, you know, they bring you in that like first room, I guess. It’s like the triage. Like, yeah, at Northwestern, and then it’s just chill. And then it was around 730 I was like, oh contractions big time. Everything’s happening. And they’re like, Okay, let’s take you upstairs. To the mainstage with all the lights. 

 

P: Yeah, yeah. 

 

L: Yeah. And then contractions were coming very hard and very fast. And they had taken my blood as soon as I got in there because they wanted to know, you know, when was my last heparin shot? 

 

P: Yeah. 

 

L: The blood results were taking forever. I think they even took a second set of bloods at one point. We just weren’t getting the results inside. It just felt like it felt like forever. Yeah, just waiting and waiting and waiting. And I don’t know what time it was, but I was just like, can I have an epidural? Because this is happening. I thought, I’m going to give birth like soon and the OB wasn’t there yet. Because they’re like, It’s first time waiting on bloods like, just, you know, we’re just going to work through the pain and I was like, No, I think this baby’s like, coming tonight. And everyone thought I was crazy. But then I remember at one point a resident came in and she was like, it’s coming fast. Like this is actually quite fast like we do. We actually do need the doctor here very soon.

 

P: So that means you’re pretty dilated.

 

L: I was pretty dilated. I think I was about I was like like maybe 8 when results came back by then they just ran in the anesthesiologist. And at that point, I was having some pretty hardcore contractions. That is when I had my epidural, which kind of set off the chain of events that were not so great. So 

 

P: yeah, I mean, that alone is pretty tricky, right? Because you’re you’re supposed to bend over and be still which is not relaxing. Right? 

 

L: I could not be still at that point. Yeah. So I yeah, I remember sitting up on the bed. Really. It was, it was hard. And he’s doing the epidural and suddenly my right leg just like shot out. I said Starburst. Everyone was like what? And the anesthesiologist was not super kind. He came around and he said, Well, you should have told me that you had scoliosis. I was like, I don’t have scoliosis, to my knowledge. And he was like, Well, I think you do. And he’s like there’s a puncture. And you might have a spinal headache. Or you might not might be fine who knows? And then he just kind of left 

 

P: Good Lord. 

 

L: I was like, what happened there? And I felt really strange because obviously, the epidural didn’t take. I was leaking spinal fluid. Oh, so yeah, so it was dizzy. And I was still feeling everything. Yeah. Still just yeah, basically just gave natural childbirth. So yeah, I remember saying to the nurse, I don’t think that worked. And she was like, Oh, what happened there what was going on? Because he didn’t really communicate with anyone else in the room as far as like what had just happened. And so you know, she had to kind of go after him and was like, what, what’s going on? And, you know, we need to talk to the OB who still was not there at that point. 

 

P: Yikes. 

 

L: So it was kind of like loose chaos. Yeah, I was in a lot of pain. And I know they gave me something but I’m not sure what it was. At one point. And then, very soon after, it was just like, it was just time it was just time to give birth because it was just happening. Like, it was just like a freight train. It was crazy. So I gave birth at 2am. So you know how so? Yeah, it happened to start at like 730 

 

P: that is fast…thats 10 hours…

 

L: Yeah, it was really, really fast. I remember to at one point, I looked at B nurse and I said, How many babies do you think you’ve delivered? And she was like, Oh, I just I couldn’t even I couldn’t even begin to tell you and I was like, Okay, we’re gonna do this because I’ve got to push. I’ve got to do it. And she was like, No, can you wait like 20 minutes? I was like, I absolutely cannot wait 20 minutes and she was like, okay, so then we just did it. And I didn’t push for very long. I pushed maybe maybe for an hour. I remember Audrey was actually on her way out like she was it was the last push. And the doctor came into the room and she goes, Oh, we have a baby. 

 

P: Wow

 

L: We do. So yeah, so that was Santa to ham. All good. I felt very dizzy or really

 

P: are we doing anything. For the leaking spinal fluid, or do they patch you up or something?

 

L: I think at that point that OB had, did not know or was not briefed just yet as to what was going on. So we were just kind of carrying on as normal pretty much and then it wasn’t until they got me down into the room. I think it was like the head of anesthesiology came in and he was assessing me and he was like How are you feeling? I heard about what happened like what’s going on? And I was like, I just feel really dizzy. And he’s like, okay, he’s like no headache. No like no stiffness in your neck. No, like, no. I mean, I’m just completely out of it. I don’t know. I just had a baby. This might be normal. 

 

P: yeah, Yeah. 

 

L: And he was like, Okay, so we’re gonna continue to monitor you. And then I kind of knew it was serious, maybe like an hour or two later because I kept getting visits from like, anesthesiologists. I guess they kept coming in. 

 

P: Yeah, that’s unnerving.

 

L: Yeah. And I was like, oh, something’s wrong, because I didn’t really know what a Dural puncture was right. I was like, I don’t know what went wrong like some spinal fluid leak. Does that mean it sounds bad? But yeah, no one’s freaking out. So yeah, it seems like this might resolve itself. And also when he left the room, he was so casual like, well, you might have a headache. So

 

P: okay, so what’s a dural puncture and how does it cause a headache?

 

Dr. Sur: So the way that an epidural is done they use a spinal needle so long needle and the needle is placed in between the vertebral bodies which are the you know, the bones that make up the spine. And in between the vertebral bodies you have a disc you pass the needle through this disc and through the spinal ligaments and into what’s called the epidural space. So this is outside of the dura, which is the membrane that covers the spinal cord. The idea is to not touch the dura, it’s to land the needle just before the dura and allow the medication to pass into the epidural space. The anesthesia numbs the pelvic area so that you don’t feel the pain of the delivery of the labor. It’s a very small space. And one of the risks is that the needle has passed too far and hits the actual dura. Then you’re in the compartment of fluid that bathes the spinal cord and bathes the spinal nerves with a Dural puncture. This is commonly done when patients have what’s called a lumbar puncture or a spinal tap. So the needle is intentionally passed through the dura to collect the cerebrospinal fluid or if that’s not the objective in an epidural anaesthetic, the CSF or cerebrospinal fluid leaks and that will change the pressure is dynamic around the spinal cord and within the skull, and that can cause a headache that low pressure can cause a headache.

 

L: I mean, I guess I’ll have a headache.

 

P: spinal fluids is one of those things that sounds like it needs to be on the inside. Yeah, any on the outside.

 

L: It seems it seems like a serious situation. But I just was like maybe this is okay, because everyone’s acting very calm about it until they were Yeah, yeah. Until about 5am. Yeah,

 

P: you’re dizzy laying down.

 

L: Yeah, and I tried. I was trying to explain it at one point like, like an old tube TV like when it sort of like blinks? 

 

P: Yeah, 

 

L:  was kind of like what my vision was like, like it was like I couldn’t settle. Just kind of couldn’t focus on one thing. It was kind of like I was like blinking out a little bit. So that was an even lying down. So yeah, that was what I was experiencing at that moment. I told someone that I was like, I can’t really like, focus on you. Everything’s kind of going hazy. I felt like a plane that had been depressurized, I guess in a way just sort of like waving in the wind and weird that point they were like Okay, so we’re gonna try a couple of things. And this was also very complicated because I’m back on Heparin, now back on a blood thinner. And they’re like, Okay, we’ve got a timeout a couple of different treatments for you. So one was a sort of like hormonal therapy that I didn’t quite understand to hopefully patch up this leak, and the other was a blood patch. Which would they would take some of my blood and that they would create a clot. Yeah, and actually patch up the look. So I said okay, so we kind of had a time that out between heparin doses. Yeah. So they get me down there. And doing a blood patch with residents. My mom worked at a teaching hospital for years. My whole family is like in the medical profession like…love teaching hospitals. But here’s where one of the issues I had was like, I think we need to get someone really experienced in here. Yeah, this already went wrong sort of in the epidural stage, but they brought in a resident and they brought in a nurse and neither of them had done a blood patch before. So that was really tough. And also I was just super dehydrated. Getting blood from me, it was like impossible.

 

P: So your your veins were like collapsed. 

 

L: Yeah,

 

P: yeah. 

 

L: So I’m in there. And they’re even just trying to get a line in for this like hormonal therapy that they’re going to do and they couldn’t do it and I feel like this whole process should have been think they were like, Oh, it’ll be like an hour because we were also trying to time it out because they’re like, Well, you’ve got to feed the baby. So to feed the baby gotta get your blood shots. It’s a whole thing. But I think I was down there for about three or four hours. 

 

P: Oh, wow. 

 

L: It was them trying to get blood out. of me trying to get a vein and then the blood patch went wrong.

 

P: Well, I can imagine if you’re taking blood from someone with heparin, right, they’re putting out your clotting factors. So how’s that gonna work?

 

L: Yeah, yeah, it was all very tricky and like it just it was not going to work that time and they also just couldn’t even get enough blood from me at for that blood patch, 

 

P: are all these attempts painful because your body has already been through the Marathon of getting birth. So

 

L: yeah, that was one of the worst things that’s ever happened to me, but that three or four hours I was down there because I was in a lot of pain. It’s basically another epidural is them going into your back with needles. So I had to be very still. Yeah, I just remember like everything in My body hurt and then I was also very, very dizzy and I just felt like I was going to pass out. And at the end of it when they were like, Well, we think we may have gotten it. 

 

Because that was the other thing. They’re like, Okay, can you feel it here? Is it here or here? And I’m like, I can’t. I’m about to pass out. I don’t know what Yeah, I don’t know what’s left or what’s right at this point. But I remember at the end of that, just kind of like looking back in the room as they were wheeling me out and there was blood everywhere. Just everywhere. And I was like I feel like I was just butchered. I was completely butchered and I have no idea what happened in that room. I was trying to communicate with people to as far as like, what are we doing and what’s happening and what went wrong. And but I know at that point, I was not getting my words out very well.

 

P: I took this question about blood patches to Dr. Sur: In a perfect world. How does the blood patch work and how long do you think it would take?

 

Dr. Sur: So in a perfect world it shouldn’t take very long. What you do in a blood patch is that you you draw blood from the actual patient and then you insert the blood back into the epidural space with the idea that the clotting factors in the blood will patch up the leak, and so this is something that’s done it when a patient is suspected of having a low pressure headache from a CSF leak, typically after like a spinal tap, and when other conservative measures have been exhausted with really no improvement on the patient side then blood patches is considered 

 

P: And your husband’s not allowed to be in there for this.

 

L: No, and he was with our daughter at the time. And also he I mean, he did leave for the epidural as well. And he didn’t know if he could handle it. And I was like if you can’t handle it, it’s cool. Just go at that point. I did want him to stay with our daughter. And yeah, I was like I don’t know if I’ll be able to come back and feed her because Yeah, who knows what’s gonna happen down there. And so I got back up to the room. And I just remember the nurse saying to me, Well, you took too long so we had to bottle feeder. I was like I didn’t take too long.

 

P: Yeah, no kidding, good lord.

 

L: So she was very disappointed that Audrey was not breastfed at that point. But it was what it was.

 

P: That’s another hobbyhorse I have about the pressure to breastfeed when other things are going on. Right right. We’re doing our best lady

 

L: I was like I’m trying I have no idea what’s happening.

 

P: I’m apparently donating all my blood out my back. So I don’t have time to Yeah, it’s not it’s kind of a bummer because you’re also emotionally fragile after all that right you are just given birth and you do have hormones swirling everywhere. And like be nice

 

L: I haven’t slept I have. Yeah, yeah. Been just freaked out as far as what’s going on. And I remember like they had Audrey at that point and I kind of went to lay down and I had a feeling that nothing worked. anesthesiologists had come in and they said, well, let’s see how that took. You know, let’s give it you know, a few hours. See how you feel. Hopefully, you know, you’ll feel better soon. I texted my best friend. I was like, Dude, I just want to let you know like things did not go well. I just I love you and I don’t know. I’m gonna make it out of here. It was like it was pretty like it was pretty dark at that point.

 

P: That’s really intense. Now, did they tell you like there’s a risk that that you’ll die from this or like, what why do you feel this way?

 

L: I think it was just everything that went down in that room like I’m trying so hard. I knew they didn’t get enough blood. I knew that it probably didn’t work. I felt like I hadn’t held up my end because when we were doing the blood patch they were very much like okay, we need you to communicate with us and tell us is it here is it here? Is it here is it here and I was like I just guys I don’t know. I don’t know where you should put the needle? I don’t know. And so

 

P: I don’t know if I could do that today. On coffee Right? Right even not even counting all the things that you went through. Like it’s just not that easy.

 

L: So I just felt like I had failed. That point. And I didn’t feel well. And I just was like this is not this is not good. Just so you know. 

 

P: Yeah. 

 

L: But then I went to sleep for like a minute. And I woke up and I was able to stand up and like walk around. Everyone was like really happy like I could see like OB was just like everyone looks so relieved. Like she’s walking. It’s okay. Looks like everything’s maybe going the way we want it to go. I did feel like pretty decent overnight. And so I was like okay, well maybe maybe I’m all right. 

 

P: So less dizzy. 

 

L: Less Dizzy was walking around, was talking fine. Like everything seemed okay. So they let me go home the next morning. 

 

P: aaaahhh

 

L: So they said yep, we think you’re good. Go home. And it was crazy because it was like as soon as I got home as soon as I walked in the door. I was like, oh, no, something’s wrong. And I just again like the dizziness came back. I couldn’t focus I couldn’t see. I was very, very weak. And I just immediately had to go to bed and couldn’t move. The anesthesiologists. They wanted me to call like every couple hours, to sort of update them my condition. So that was kind of what the next I think the next 24 hours where I was calling them and I was like, I can’t get out of bed like I can’t move. I don’t know what’s going on. My neck was so stiff. Just I could I couldn’t turn my head.

 

P: Is this ringing a bell because the the senior anesthesiologist had said Do you have a stiff neck?

 

L: I know right. And I kept telling them that as like I have a stiff neck. What does that mean? Because I remember he said something about it.

 

P: So the anesthesiology team keeps asking Lauren about neck stiffness after the dural puncture were they looking for where’s that mean?

 

Dr. Sur: So that’s associated with infections of the meninges again, the infection of the dura for example, or the membrane that covers the brain and spinal cord. And there can be stiffness in something like meningitis.

 

L: And one guy I remember that I kept calling That night. he was like he was the guy manning the phones, I guess. he was like, well, I don’t know. I mean, you just gave birth.

And you gave birth pretty quick. It’s gotta be he probably just pulled a muscle. so that’s he’s like, that’s normal. it’s very normal. and I was like, well, I’m really weak. like I can’t make it to the bathroom like my husband was having to get me, you know, to the bathroom, which is like four feet out of our bedroom. And he was like well you just gave birth you lost a lot of God, I don’t know like just lay down and I don’t know. 

 

I started having these insane like very intense headaches. I kept calling them back and I was like, my head is bursting. I don’t know what to do I seen lights like things are not going well. And they’re like, Okay, well you need caffeine. So we’re going to get you some caffeine, like some pills. Just drink soda, drink anything coffee, just get your your caffeine levels up. So that was like the start of the caffeine rush, which I think lasted for a long time.

 

And I was just and I was just high on caffeine. 

 

P: This seems very bad because you haven’t slept. You’ve been through this ruinous thing.

Now they’re saying  chug Mountain Dew. This feels wrong. 

 

L: Yeah, yeah, it was It was wild. Yeah, it was wild. So yeah, so I’m caffeine. Still could barely move. My head was not right. My mom who thankfully at one point was a neuro nurse. 

 

P: Wow. 

 

L: She was ER for career but she also didn neuro as well. She was just like, This isn’t right. She’s like you got to stop calling These anesthesiologists we need to call just other doctors. And I literally was just like calling random doctors at Northwestern trying to get my you know my doctor my my OB like just anyone I could be just anyone I could and just sort of get them on the phone and explain to them like what was going on. So I think it was my primary care physician who was just like, okay, because this was like an info dump for her. 

 

P: Yeah, yeah, 

 

L: no idea what’s going on. And she was like, I want you to go to the Pain Center at Northwestern because maybe, like maybe something went wrong with this. And we just got to get you in there. Right away. And that was a whole situation of trying to get me scheduled to go into there and 

 

P: but you can’t just show up right? 

 

L: You can’t just show up, right. You can’t just show up. They have wait months for days. And yeah, I remember initially like we called and they were like, well we can get you in and you know, I’m like three weeks and they’re like no, she needs someone right now right now. So they were like okay, can you get here in like 20 minutes and we’re like, no, but we’ll try. Yeah. So I showed up and I probably got there 45 minutes later because of traffic. 

 

P: Yeah, 

 

L: this poor girl who was working the front desk. I think this was like her first day and I show up, I can barely move. And I’m like, I have this appointment. And she’s like, Oh, I’m so sorry. Like you missed it. And I think we can reschedule for like a few weeks and I’m sorry and she just like didn’t know what to do. And again I’m very much a person that doesn’t like, I don’t want to make a scene, but I just couldn’t like I couldn’t stop crying. And I don’t know why at that point. I just want to walk across the street and go to the ER but I was just like, I’m in so much pain. I don’t think anyone’s taking it seriously. I don’t know what to do.

And I was sobbing. And this woman who was in the waiting room goes, I don’t know what that woman has been through, but she can have my appointment, because this is wrong. Yeah,

 

P: that’s nice.

 

L: It was nice. So she was like she can have my appointment right now. Just get her to see a doctor right now. And the girl at the desk ran and grabbed a doctor and they brought me in and we did some X rays. We of course establish that the blood patch did not work. And so they said we’re going to do another blood patch, this time under X ray. So they did that and they’re like, You should feel like in an hour after we do this blood patch like you should feel relief. Like okay, so they do the blood patch it takes 15 minutes really, really quick. Yeah, 15 minutes tops. They put me in a room. Lay me down. And I felt like pretty decent when I was laying down at that point, and then they were like, Okay, we’ll give it an hour and then we’ll lift you up and we’ll see how you feel. gave it an hour. I get up and I’m just like, no. Still feel bad. So my neck hurts. I can’t, something’s wrong. They were just like, well, go home. 

 

P: NOOO

 

L: Take some pills. Lay down. And again, this one doctor said, you know, you’ve just given birth. It’s a lot probably just stressed. I was at the point crying. I couldn’t really communicate very well. He was like, You’re just I mean, it basically was like you’re just hysterical. You’re hysterical woman. Who’s probably hurt her neck and childbirth. And yeah, there’s nothing we can do. Like we did the blood patch. It’s great. You’re gonna be fine. Just give it some time. 

 

So I go home. And again, in terrible, terrible pain and I just start this round of phone calling again. Just calling people like something’s wrong. And I get on the phone with my OB nurse. I’m just explaining everything that happened to her and she was like, This is not right. Like none of this is right. And she’s like you need to go to the ER right now. And before before I had talked to her actually, what was something that was really crazy. There was another doctor I was talking to who had access the records from the Pain Center. Because he was like, Well, let me see what they said. Let me see. You know what the notes are and in the notes, the doctor who basically told me to just go home and lay down had said, You know what, her brain should be scanned for clots. That was not communicated to anyone that was not communicated to my primary care physician. It was not communicated to me it was not communicated to my OB we don’t

 

P: I don’t understand how it made it in the notes but not to anyone’s notice why it made no I didn’t he order things and if that’s what thought 

 

L: unclear, that’s like a big question that I have big question. And I actually even called up the Pain Center and I mean I at this point was just like, just nuts. I just losing my mind and I said, you know, this is what this anesthesiologist told me. This isn’t the notes Was anyone going to tell me Was anyone going to tell me are you gonna call me and they were like, oh, yeah, we were, you know, he went he went out. He left he went to lunch. He hasn’t come back yet. But yeah, there’s an order here for you to go to the ER.

 

P: Oh my god. was we were telepathically sending you like yeah sending you 

L: Yeah. And just it just was not communicated. So I was like, Okay, well, I’m going to the ER please send that order to the ER. FYI. Yeah. Um, and they were Yeah, and they were like, Okay, we’ll send it right now. cuz then I get to be er, and they’re like, We don’t have an order here. But thankfully, I had everything on my phone and they were like, Okay. And then a nurse came over the nurse that was assigned to me and she was about eight months pregnant. And at that point, I could barely move. I was just crying. I just handed her my phone. I was like, just read anything on here. I don’t I don’t know what to say. And I just remember like, she started to cry. She was like, she couldn’t hold it together. And I was like, Well, this is bad. I don’t know what what happened here, but this is all bad. And like, she brought me back she brought me back, you know, they were taking my blood pressure and doing all that stuff. And she just was like, disturbed as sort of my husband was kind of telling her what went down. And then they took me into another room and a doctor came in and we kind of went over everything but at that point, I was in so much pain. I was just gripping the hospital bed. And I was just my jaw was just like grind grinding, I couldn’t talk and my husband was doing all the talking for me. And the doctor was very straightforward. He’s like, Oh, yeah, she’s had a stroke. Yeah. What? He was like, Yeah, this is the stroke patient right here. No one knew that. I knew like he knew immediately. It was like two minutes in.

 

P: Good lord. Yeah. 

 

L: And he was like all the signs were there. He was like, Oh yeah, the the weakness and she’s like weak on her left side and it’s yeah, the blinding headaches where she’s seeing lights and all of the things that you described. Yeah, she’s had a stroke.

 

P: can you tell us what happens in a stroke and why women are at higher risk during pregnancy and after delivery?

 

L: So a stroke is essentially a sudden, acute neurological deficit. One type of stroke is a clot in the venous system of the brain. So ischemic stroke is typically thought of a clot in the arterial system in the arteries of the brain. And then there’s the hemorrhagic types of stroke which is rupture of the arteries typically, and then there can be clotting within the veins of the brain that can also contribute to stroke the risk of that is higher. So in pregnant women, the risk of stroke is actually three times greater than in non pregnant women. of the same age. The risk is essentially in the peri partum period, and in the postpartum period of just up to six weeks after after the delivery. So she kind of was in that very high risk period of developing a stroke. In the peri partum and postpartum period,

 

P: because we have so much more blood volume or because of the estrogen, there’s a lot of clotting factors running around.  why are we at higher risk?

 

Dr. Sur: So what it’s all related to the kind of physiological changes that happen during the delivery and so right after the delivery, essentially, the body is going into kind of clotting mode, because all of the blood vessels and all of the vasculature that fed the fetus is no longer necessary, and to prevent essentially postpartum hemorrhage or bleeding out from those vessels. They all have to kind of clot off and that’s why the uterus also contracts a lot immediately after the the delivery to try and then close off the vasculature to the uterus, which is no longer necessary once the fetus has been delivered. So you’re essentially in this pro thrombotic state where clotting factors are elevated and and so it’s, that’s why it’s a high risk period.

 

L: part of me was almost relieved, in a sense, because I was like, one believes that something’s wrong.

 

P: Yeah. Yeah, that was like that nurse was the first person to have a human reaction. To everything you’ve been going through, right?

 

L: Yes, absolutely. I think everyone else was very much like, she’s a problem. She keeps calling like, we just need to shuffle her off. And yeah, so he’s like, Yeah, we need to get her CAT scan, He’s like, Yeah, let’s get her in there. And see what’s going on. And so this was kind of almost funny. I mean, my husband and I laugh about it now, but I was like, I don’t know if I can go in there because I was in so much pain and I just needed something to like, hold on to 

 

P: Yeah. 

 

L: And so they’re like, Okay, we’re gonna give you something to calm you down. They were just like, is there any chance you could be pregnant? But absolutely. 

 

P: good news…Yeah. 

 

L: And they’re like, Are you sure? And I was like, I just had a baby like two days. ago. Yeah. And they’re like, Well, yeah, you know, sometimes people. I was like, they do not, they do not. I was like, I promise you. There is absolutely no way I’m pregnant. I said it maybe 15 times. They’re like alright, okay. So then they give me the Dilaudid and do the scan. And then after the scan, the next thing I remember as I was in the ICU, and I was hooked up to many machines, and there were lots of residents and we were talking about the stroke and how it had affected my right side. My right side was very weak. And my speech at that point was not good. And my neck was very stiff, and I couldn’t I couldn’t really move bad scene. And then I think it was like Audrey’s first appointment with a pediatrician. I can’t remember what time this was. I feel like it was like maybe two in the morning or something. And John was like, I’ve got to go take her to the pediatrician at 8am. And I was like, Okay, I was like, just go like, You should go. 

 

He was a mess. So I was in the ICU for quite a while. Which is a weird thing I remember. Maybe it was the next day or the day after. They have an occupational therapist come in and they’re like, Okay, today we’re going to work on putting on socks and maybe taking a walk up and down the hall. Do you think about that and you’re like, wow, I have a little baby at home who I never seen. How am I gonna change a diaper? 

 

P: Yeah, 

 

L: you know how to put on my socks. So yeah, so that was a thing and I was just trying to push through and I was I was in there as like you know what, I’m gonna just I’m gonna beat it. I’m gonna put on my socks. I’m gonna like run around in the hallways. I’m gonna show them that I’m like, I’m fine. But it was very much not fine. So then finally I get to a step down, ICU. And just so many tests, so many things. are going on. So many people are talking around me, including all of the residents of the neuro like it’s, but no one’s talking to me. 

 

P: Yeah, 

 

L: essentially, which I think, say the first five days in the hospital. That was pretty much the case. I was in a lot of pain. And I didn’t know what the source of the pain was. And again, I kept talking to them like, Oh, my, it really hurts at the epidural site, like it’s I’m really, like really sore, and they’re like, Yeah, you’re gonna be sore. And I’m like, I still can’t move my neck like what’s going on with my neck? And they’re like, oh, you know, the patch is sealed. Like we’re getting your blood under control. Like, let’s, we’ll see it just like no answers. And I remember I hadn’t slept for days. It was again middle of the night. And this nurse comes in and I just was like I said before you do anything, like we need to have talk as like, I just need I need someone on my side. And I don’t know what’s wrong with me. I don’t know if this is normal. Do you know if it’s normal, but I’m in so much pain, and I just feel like I just I’ve just I feel like I’m gonna die tonight. Like, this is really bad. And she was like, okay, she’s like, first of all, let’s get a scan because they wanted to make sure I didn’t have a bleed and my brain scan comes out like normal. You know, there’s clots in your brain. But nothing’s bleeding. 

 

So, blah, you’re fine. She comes back. And she’s like, well, you know, do you feel better? What do you think what, you know, this is what happened. They said, You know, it’s the same. I’m like, something is wrong. Like, I can’t I can’t move. And she was like, well, has anyone given you like Gabapentin and I’m like, no, like, I’m just on like, Tylenol. 

 

P: Oh my god. 

 

L: And she was like, Okay. And so she like, grabs a doctor and she’s having this conversation with him. And I hear them get into an argument in the hallway where she’s like, just try it. Like it’s not gonna hurt her. Why can’t we just try it? She’s in a lot of pain. She can’t move. She can barely talk to us. This is insane. And he’s like, Fine, whatever. And he approves it. And I felt like the Gabapentin had saved my life. Like as soon as I started it, I felt like I was just a stone, just like a statue before it was so everything was so tight. I couldn’t move anything. And then as I was taking gabapentin, as I was sort of like ramped up on it, it suddenly like move again. And I could talk and suddenly I was like myself and I told that to one of the doctors. And he was like, oh, you know what, now that we think about it. So where the blood clots were in my brain, it was sort of blocking the blood flow from like, just guess exiting your brain and that pressure was building up and it was putting pressure on my nerves. So that’s why I couldn’t couldn’t move my neck. So it was all that pressure. And he’s like, yeah, he’s like, I guess that would be painful. 

 

P: Oh, my God. Now that we think of it, yeah, what were we doing last few days?

 

L: What were we doing? What were we doing? And I know I’ve read all of my my notes, which I requested from Northwestern and I had hundreds of pages of them. And it’s marked in the chart like the difference there like oh, one day she was just gripping, but could not get up, gripping the side of the hospital bed, would not move and would barely communicate. And literally the next day was standing up and was talking to us like okay, what’s going on guys? What’s happening? 

 

So yeah, it’s like in the charts and it was just wild. And then the hospital experience was very different after the Gabapentin I was like, I’m taking control of this situation. Yeah, I was quite motivated. I had a lot of adrenaline in a sense, like, especially after that Gabapentin. It was like, Yeah, after that change. I was just like, Oh, I’m taking control of this whole situation, and I’m going to be fine. And you guys need to all tell me like how I need to get there. Yeah, one of the things I need to do I need to lift weights do I need to get on the treadmill every day for 30? Like I was just like, we’re gonna do this because I couldn’t figure out how life was gonna be with my daughter especially in those first six months. Or even the first three months when I had my new those clots were still in my brain. And what if a clot moves? Or what if my brain started bleeding? Yeah, I think that was really scary to me. I was really scared to be alone with my daughter for a really long time.

 

P: Yeah, that sounds super scary. And they just resolve on their own. Is that how we let that

 

L: be to the to us you’re Yeah, and you’re on the blood thinner until they resolve and mine did resolve this all went down in June. I believe I had my MRI, it was like late September. And they’re like, Okay, great. They’re gone. And I remember seeing my neurologist after that, and she was like, you’re really lucky that all just took away. It’s like they were never there. And I was like, Okay,

 

P: wow, that is amazing. 

 

L: Yeah. 

 

P: Ultimately, it was the epidural. That was the problem. Right. 

 

L: And yeah, ultimately, what we found out was the epidural, of course, like set off that chain of events, so it was botched and then the blood patch. At one that was like a three hour blood. Yeah, ouch. Yeah. That was the one that sent those clots actually up into my brain. Wow. So instead of actually feeling that Leah, that’s where they went. And then the second blood patch is the one that finally patched it and sealed it, but at that point, stroke time. 

 

P: good Lord, so it’s like all those compounding things. Right.

 

L: And it’s, it’s a wild situation, right? Like none of this is typical, but it was pretty crazy. I think. Also, it was really hard for like a lot of the anesthesiologists who were also residents that I was like calling and dealing with, was that the spinal headache symptoms are, I mean, they’re kind of similar to a stroke. And so they kept going to the spinal headache thing saying like, well, I don’t know the headache. Yeah. And she’s weak. She just gave birth. So they just kept deferring to that it never occurred to them, that there had been a stroke. I mean, I guess it It occurred to the guy at the Pain Center, but he didn’t say anything. But when I went to the ER and that doctor was just like, oh, yeah, she’s had a stroke. Like, guys, come on.

 

P: Yeah. Yeah. Because you passed through many hands before you got there.

 

L: Yeah, they didn’t realize that was the thing. 

 

P: Let’s now reflect on the things that we have learned from this unbelievably traumatic experience. Yeah. If you could go back. What would you tell younger you and what do you take from this experience?

 

L: Well, I think it’s been more of an advocate for myself in those situations, which is hard. It’s really hard with a doctor because they’re the expert, right? They went to school for so long. They’ve been doing this forever. They’ve seen so many people, but I do think, especially in this case, a lot of people were very disconnected from me as a person. And they didn’t see me as a person. They saw me as problem. And remember, even we’ll say I was about seven months pregnant somewhere around there. Saw that Serena Williams Vogue story about her childbirth experience.

 

P: In case you missed it, Serena Williams gave birth and 2018. The day after the birth she became short of breath, and she worried that it was a clotting issue, given that she had a serious blood clot in her lungs in 2011 that required emergency care. The shortness of breath she felt after the birth very much reminded her of that earlier experience. When she tried to get help for it. She was dismissed numerous times by medical people around her. Ultimately, they found that she did in fact have a blood clot in her lungs

 

L: and I remember taking that into my doctor’s office, because I was terrified when I read that story. And I was like, Oh God, what if this happens to me, I’ve had this you know, clotting issue like this could easily happen to me and still get in there. And like how do we make this not happen? Like have you read this and I will say that I was easily dismissed was like, ah, that won’t happen to you. This is not the same blah, blah, blah just kind of brushed it off.

 

P: How can it not be the same? I mean, I I definitely had a fear of God reaction to that in that Williams is beloved famous, wealthy. You know, right, powerful. If she can’t make it happen. How’s anyone else gonna make it happen?

 

L; I know. No. And I just was like, how do we like I just was like, how do we learn from this? I learned from this Yeah. And I remember everyone be like, It’s fine. Don’t worry about it. Just just, you know, just trust us is basically what was the message? And I think in all of that, and especially in those two days, when I was just calling people and I wanted to believe those anesthesiologists who were saying, like, just lay down, like, just lay down. You know, you’re gonna feel great after hours asleep, like taking ibuprofen, like it’d be fine. And I really wanted to believe that but I knew something was wrong. And I think I should have been in that moment, a stronger advocate for myself, I should have just gone immediately to the ER and been like something is wrong. I really should have listened to that inner voice because it was right. Yeah, essentially. 

 

P: Yeah. 

 

L: So that has been what I’ve really taken into my healthcare practice today is Yeah, I do treat it almost like a business. I don’t feel like I should have to but when I do go to the doctor. I mean, I bring a notebook. They document a lot of things. Yeah. And I run it like a meeting. And I talk a lot. Yeah, and I ask people to clarify things and repeat things. Some doctors don’t care for it, but some are absolutely fine with it, especially once they have seen my medical history. 

 

P: Yeah, yeah. 

 

L: They actually are okay. And I feel like I’ve had a much different experience now. And I’ve even been really upfront with some doctors where I’d say like, listen, it feels like you’re sort of brushing me off right now and I have not had a great past. So can we go over this again? Or do you think maybe I would be a better fit with someone else? And some people are they really, you know, change after you are that direct? They really start to see this more as a partnership. Oh, that’s been really beneficial. 

 

P: I’m gonna steal that language that that is a really good way to say it and to get their attention apparently, right. 

 

L: Yes. Yeah. I mean, I get it too, especially now. I mean, with COVID Everyone’s stressed out. Everyone’s been working too much. Again, family, they’re all nurses. My some of my best friends. It’s a high pressure situation. So I have a lot of respect for them. But also, I’m just like, I’m gonna need you to give me time and your full time and attention right now.

 

P: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I’m glad that you’re back. Thank you. We’ve recovered everything that’s awesome. And inspiring. And what is your three year old into now?

 

L: Oh, gosh, DC Superhero Girls loves that. Yes. Loves the cape just runs around back and forth. Bubbles. Wow. Bubbles are a hit. But if you Yeah, she’s very cute. She’s very, very active. She’s always just yeah, she’s on time. She’s early. She’s ready to go up every day at seven o’clock. Just like what do we do and where are we going?

 

P: Very cute. that does sound like the baby who comes in 10 hours instead of 23. 

 

L: Yeah, exactly. 

 

P: Well, Lauren, thank you so much for coming on and sharing your story. And I think if I’m right when we talked in the very beginning of this, you’re a writer so you’re sharing stories all the time, right?

 

L: I am indeed. You know what’s insane is that when I was in the hospital, I had had this like book proposal that was just on my desktop at home and I got home I was like, I’m gonna send this off. And I wrote a very cocky proposal letter and I was like, You should publish this book because it’s great. And then the publisher responded like seven hours later and they said, Okay, we will. So yeah, that you know, near death, adrenaline that was going through me, 

 

P: that’s  awesome 

 

L: But yeah, I have a podcast called bonnets of dawn, which is about 18th 19th and 20th century women writers. And then my book is called why she wrote and it is about 18th 19th and 20th century women writers.

 

P: That’s super cool. Awesome. Thank you so much. Thanks so much for sharing your story. 

 

L: Yeah, thank you for having me. 

 

P: So thanks again to Dr. Sur for sharing her medical insights…and thanks to Lauren for sharing what is a really important story. Likely we will never know the full picture of what happened; how did so many people fail to show a requisite amount of interest in her experience, how did so many lack real curiosity about her case…it’s hard to get your mind around. 

 

It’s possible that when so many people brushed past her complaints about pain and told her to just go and lie down it’s a reflection of, among other things, a cultural view of women after birth, and in Lauren’s case, maybe also how the medical establishment views not just women but especially black women. There’s a fair amount of literature documenting the fact that black patient’s pain is often managed differently than pain for white patients .  It feels wildly unfair that one of the take aways from Lauren’s experience is that after you’ve birthed a baby and your body is wrung out, you are responsible not only for this new human being’s survival, but also your own advocacy…please share this story with friends, because even though it feels like too much to ask, it’s where we are today.

 

Thanks for listening,

 

We’ll be back soon with another story of overcoming.